Consciosly "laying off" at the top?

[Gibby]

A friend of mine who can hit it a mile has a move I commonly see but I hardly understand.

He:

1. has a modern, one-piece, straight back takeaway
2. releases his hips and lifts his heel about an inch
3. completes a very full backswing in good rhythm

The moment he begins to drop the anchor of his heel, it looks as if he allows the clubhead to fall slightly toward the ground behind him without dropping his hands in the same direction. Again, this is done in the rhythm of his backswing. By the time he plants his heel and he is in the pocket, the move has already taken place. I've asked him about it and he says it's called "laying off" and it helps him come from the inside. He's been playing since he was a kid and apparently he can't remember a time when he didn't do it.

Is this a move that is advisable for a mature beginner to cultivate?

[Jim Kobylinski]

IMO this is a death move, however he has done it forever so i'd leave it alone; he's "grooved it." I'd never ever teach anyone to do this.

[cmartingolf]

I agree with Jim. You can't teach that move and if you try and fix that move when it gets sideways it is miserable.

I see that in Sergio and Nick Price. Both players can square the clubface with the best pivots on the planet. Mortals shouldn't try it.

[Notorious B.E.N.]

what if you do it a little naturally?

I see from camera as I start down the club lays off a little.

Is this a double shift?

[Brian Manzella]

Originally Posted by Notorious B.E.N.

what if you do it a little naturally?

I see from camera as I start down the club lays off a little.

Is this a double shift?

No.

A "double shift" is a pattern where the golfer starts on the "elbow plane," shifts UP to the "turned shoulder plane" on the backswing, then on the downswing shifts back DOWN to the "elbow plane" again.

The move being talked about in this thread is simply a clubhead loading repositioning movement.

Lots of golfer do the exact opposite.

"Laying the Club Off" is simply pointing the club to the left of the target at the top of the backswing.

You could "lay the club off" on the downswing, but before I alled what Gibby's pal is doing that, I'd have to see it.

"Is this a move that is advisable for a mature beginner to cultivate?"

No.

[rogerdodger]

Avoid this move, unless your swing does it naturally, it is a killer. When I first started playing in my teens, I had a long swing, crossed the line at the top and came straight down on the ball. I could hit the ball great at times. An instructor Hoganized me, wide stance, elbow pockets out, and had me lay the club off at the top, in transition. Problem, I over did it and cannot get it out of my swing. Nothing has helped me like the soft draw backswing pattern and the feel that the left elbow never pops out in the swing. Trying to duplicate this layoff move is impossible, and for a while, killed my game. Its coming back into single digits, because I am trying to swing like a teenager again. I would warn anyone off trying to do this move, just like my older brothers warned me about LSD.

[Notorious B.E.N.]

Originally Posted by rogerdodger

Avoid this move, unless your swing does it naturally, it is a killer. When I first started playing in my teens, I had a long swing, crossed the line at the top and came straight down on the ball. I could hit the ball great at times. An instructor Hoganized me, wide stance, elbow pockets out, and had me lay the club off at the top, in transition. Problem, I over did it and cannot get it out of my swing. Nothing has helped me like the soft draw backswing pattern and the feel that the left elbow never pops out in the swing. Trying to duplicate this layoff move is impossible, and for a while, killed my game. Its coming back into single digits, because I am trying to swing like a teenager again. I would warn anyone off trying to do this move, just like my older brothers warned me about LSD.

Sounds like your teacher messed you up pretty bad, rodger.

I was just wondering if it was a killer move if I did it naturally but...

Now I know what a double shift is.

Who did this double shift the best?

[BurnItUp]

Originally Posted by Brian Manzella

No.

A "double shift" is a pattern where the golfer starts on the "elbow plane," shifts UP to the "turned shoulder plane" on the backswing, then on the downswing shifts back DOWN to the "elbow plane" again.

A double shift simply means two plane shifts between address and impact.

There are countless double shift combinations not just one.

E.g. set up on the hands-only-plane, shift up to the squared-shoulder-plane during the backswing and shift down to the turned-shoulder-plane during the downswing.

[Notorious B.E.N.]

This is what I meant I was doing naturally.

Looks like as the lag increases the club points left of my target.

[Kevin Shields]

That's not really laying it off. He's quite a bit into his downswing so the club is going to point left. He does load the club like Brian describes.

The move in question almost drove me away from the game forever.